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Please return and discuss
Luna, I am asking you to please reconsider your departure so that we can talk. We need to reach a consensus on what is helping the community and what hinders it. I have been asked to back down from my previous critical decision (which wasn't bullying - please understand that I was only correcting you and not attacking you) and try to talk with you about the issue at hand back in September - transgenderism and Autism, and Amanda Baggs. There is much we need to discuss to clear the air. Thanks. TLPG 21:47, January 11, 2016 (UTC)
Luna, let's just get a few things cleared up first. It's Amanda, not Amelia. The Tumblr blog that made the announcement is a fake, run by her haters. It was removed as a source from Amanda's Wikipedia article for this reason and the page is now Amanda again. That's why I did the same redirect here. Besides that, transgendered does not include "no gender". That's not the definition of transgendered. Transgendered is about being male in mind and female in body and vice versa (like Kaitlyn Jenner). I should also be open with you and say that you offended not only me, but also (indirectly) the Autism Women's Network by promoting "trangendered" as common amongst Autistics. The reason for that is it appeared to be a support of Simon Baron-Cohen's debunked theory that all Autistic brains are male. That's what got the AWN upset and I don't blame them for that. So it would be best if that entire subject was avoided, if that's okay. I hope you understand. Amanda has some very cruel enemies. I know a lot of her story that has not been published and I intend to change that when I can.
With the rest, let's look at this point by point and start with your priorities.
- Supporting the dignity of a/Autistic people (autism acceptance, neurodiversity paradigm, shift away from pathologized/negative model, etc.)
I agree in principle, but we do need to deal with the negative material - in that we need to put it in it's box instead of deleting it totally. It is what it is and it needs to be confronted.
- Acknowledging that it's okay to be different
- Reassuring a/Autistic people, especially the newly diagnosed, and parents of the newly diagnosed. Many of us grew up with a laundry list of things that were "wrong" with us, which is trash, so let's take out the trash and encourage others to be happy. I want to help them see that their childhood bullies were wrong about them.
I agree again, but let's not claim that we are perfect angels either. We have done things in error and it would be wrong to just throw those errors aside. Autistics are no more perfect than neurotypicals. We all have one thing in common. We're human. And sometimes we do things that should be criticised. Not bullied and made fun of naturally, but criticised which is not the same thing.
- Creating a welcoming space for a/Autistic and ally editors
I agree and that's partly why once I adopt this Wikia as I hope to I will be banning IP edits. Everyone must have an account. That's the best way to control vandals and haters.
Now for your Wikia thoughts.
- Continuing shift towards neutral/positive language in regards to autism; erasing all "autism is doom and here are 30 reasons why you'll DIE" garbage
As before the principle is sound but we can't erase the negative stuff. We have to confront it and put it in it's place.
- Cleaning up all these spam/empty pages
Already doing that. Plenty of pages already marked for deletion for various reasons including spam.
- More articles on autism symptoms, with neutral language and tips for managing them as needed, and articles on autism upsides
Working on that offline already in Notepad. I want to incorporate what's already here, because if I don't it will become a complete mess and all over the place. It needs to be organised properly and be easily and comfortably accessed. A mess will discourage new editors and readers.
- Shifting focus towards a/Autistic readers first (loved ones second)
Let's be fair. Many loved ones do speak for their Autistic charges because said charges can't read or communicate. Having said that though I agree with the concept. We want more stories and this is the way to do it.
- More articles on anti-autism groups, so that others know whom to avoid
Absolutely, and not just the groups either. The individuals to avoid as well (like Oliver Canby). I have another in my sandbox and I'm working on more offline, including but not limited to Jonathan Mitchell, Christian Chandler and Ginger Taylor. In order to put the issue in it's proper place I'm working on Adam Lanza and Chris Harper-Mercer as well.
- Mutual links between WikiHow and Wikia resources
I agree in principle, but I don't think doing question articles like WikiHow would work on Wikia. However that doesn't mean there aren't things on WikiHow that can't be used on Wikia. We can work through that.
- More positive pictures of a/Autistic people (as an artist I could get cracking on this)
Don't have a problem with that either. The more the merrier.
As far as actual actions go let's just hold for the moment because it does need a user with admin powers. That means that I do need your support for me to adopt this Wikia. My application is on my blog. But there's no reason why you can't do some work on Notepad or something similar in the meantime as I am doing. TLPG 04:31, January 12, 2016 (UTC)
- I'll address your research first. None of that suggests that transgenderism is common amongst Autistics. The AWN are simply on their side in terms of the more general concept of neurodiversity. Don't forget that ND is not limited to Autism. It applies to all conditions of the brain, such as schizophrenia for example.
- The Tumblr blog is not linked at all on any of Amanda's other established web presences, such as her You Tube channel and her Ballexistence blog. Her good friend Dave Seidel is active on Wikipedia and he would have reversed the page back to Amelia there if there was any truth to the change. On current evidence - Amanda remains Amanda. At best Amelia is a pen name used exclusively for poetry (that separate blog IS linked on Ballexistence). There is nothing else reliable to support the change.
- I'll just quote your other points.
- Obviously autism is neither all sunshine and rainbows, nor an apocalyptic horror. A focus on positivity could be helpful to autistic people's self esteem, and we can do that while acknowledging that there are real struggles and sharing resources for dealing with the rough parts.
- That's true. All I was saying is that we need to do it consistently and not repeat the exact same thing over and over which we would end up doing if we created too many articles.
- I was thinking about doing a page on murder that would deal with the myth of the autistic shooter (and also have a lot of information on caregiver murder, which is a much bigger and more real problem). I even started it, but my computer randomly shut itself down so I lost my work. This could include the speculations on autism and their harmful effects.
- Excellent idea, but to avoid the issue with your computer, do it in Notepad first and save it as you go so you don't lose it. Also there are articles on individual murders on the Wikia already (and one attempted murder) which should be referenced.
- I feel a little uncomfortable about having long pages listing reasons why people are bad. I think that we should keep them short, sweet, and to the point, so that readers don't lose interest. (Besides, even a short summary of their actions would be pretty clear.)
- Not in some cases, certainly in the case of Oliver Canby. Also, if we're brief, Autistic readers will be given room to assume and get it wrong - and that has to be avoided at all costs. We function best with more information to make better decisions.
- I've started uploading a few illustrations. I plan to focus on autistic people stimming and otherwise looking clearly autistic, to promote the view that this is normal and not a big deal.
- Good idea, but there are stims that are dangerous and do need to be dealt with differently (like self injury stims for example).
- Also: how do you add the source in the image description thing? I don't know how to do this; could you teach me?
- It's easy. Next time you upload an image, on the same page there is a section titled "File description". There are three parts. The first is a destination filename (which will give your image a name which can be different from the file name of the photo you uploaded). The second is the summary - that's where you type in the source. The third is a licensing thing, and generally you would use the I created this option for your own pictures. For others - it can vary and if you want to know which one to use, just ask. The safest one is the Fair Use one, unless you know for sure that another option is applicable. TLPG 02:43, January 14, 2016 (UTC)
Excellent pick up with the image! One thing though - you don't need to credit the source on the article itself. When you upload the picture, you should put the credit in the summary. That's all you need to do. TLPG 03:17, January 13, 2016 (UTC)
Great addition! I've added what's called a hat to it. Pretty sure there's more to be added (she was on The View for a time and is the spokesperson at least for Generation Rescue, not to mention the various other comments she has made about the treatment of her son - and I know I saw some other people state that her son isn't Autistic and never was to begin with) but I just don't have time to go looking for sources at present. TLPG 21:43, January 14, 2016 (UTC)
Yes and No
Luna, I do like the Ask an Autistic page, but adding another page about the hashtag is overdoing it - that's why I marked it for deletion. The two should be together because the name is exactly the same, and I have added the deleted article text to the other page accordingly so it's not lost entirely. That's the mess I was talking about that we need to avoid in order to not confuse readers. With the Autism positivity article - I'm not sure where it fits so I'm not sure if it should be left or merged with something else. I really think we need the positivity to lie in the other existing articles rather than something separate like that - for instance in articles like Stimming and the other trait articles. TLPG 21:38, January 17, 2016 (UTC)
- They share the name and the purpose. The purpose being "Ask an Autistic". The article works better talking about the purpose. If you divide it up you have two articles that are about the same thing - just done differently. That's a waste of page space and it is confusing to have them separate. TLPG 22:20, January 19, 2016 (UTC)
Active or not
You claimed to be no longer active, and yet you have been changing images. I have reverted them and protected them as well as deleting your story as it would appear you did not want it here anymore. If you are not active, do not upload any more images. If you replace more, you will be regarded as active and your page will be fully restored as will your user page to it's version before your latest edits. NurseTN (talk) 06:56, 23 November 2020 (UTC)